Friday, October 29, 2010

Banned again … How do you spell relief? *Update #3!*

**WARNING** DO NOT PROCEED PAST THIS POINT IF YOU ARE AFFLICTED WITH ANY OF THESE CONDITIONS:
  • Terminal anality – This suppresses your sense of humor.
  • Uncontrolled self-righteousness – This leads to terminal anality.
  • Fragile ego disorder – This leads to uncontrolled self-righteousness.
The rest of you, enjoy.

Ok, this is funny. Yesterday, the 3rd thread in two days designed to complain pretty much specifically about me and a few others was created. People whinging about this or that without anything specific just teeing off because their lives suck in some undefined way.

So I get this notice this morning from the DPReview Admins …

image

Obviously, the attack pack and associated sycophants hit the button a lot more than I thought they did … *half* the complaints in the entire system? Wow.

Interestingly though, I quite agree with them that a holiday is in order. FTF has become a bit of a wasteland lately … not much interesting happening, partially because Fuji is doing nothing interesting and partially because the forum is overrun with people who are starting at the beginning. Not that there is anything wrong with that … just that answering the same set of questions year after year gets old. So I totally agree with the mods … 3 weeks off sounds great.

I have to finish processing the Josh Ritter concert plus the opener – Basia Bulat – and the WIntersleep concert from last night, where I recorded parts of the two openers – Rah Rah and Besnard Lakes – with the F300EXR and then every single minute of the Wintersleep performance with the Panny ZS3. Lots of work there … I expect to do 20+ videos to add to my YouTube channel, which sits at 93 videos right now …
So my hat is off to the attack pack … you got me again … and to clarify the number of bannings, I have *not* been banned 14 times … I would be willing to stipulate to 9 :-)

Update: Dave says that “things have started changing”, yet the “gagged and handcuffed” thread degenerated into an insult fest with the attack pack being dominant … this should give DPReview moderators a fairly clear insight into the real trouble makers. So apparently self-righteously hammering the complaint button does not give one any credibility or perspective …

Further note on bans. For those that do not read the comments on my posts, Billx08 and Rattymouse were both banned. I suspect Bill’s was similar to mine, although likely only 7 days. Ratty is gone *permanently* … a gross overreaction in my opinion. Although Ratty gets invested in certain feelings (HS10 bad, X100 good) he is also interesting and enthusiastic. But he teed off on the moderators pretty harshly and started the third toxic thread of last week.

Yanko started the first, Richard the second. Ratty was the third man in, and even in hockey that can be a real problem … :-)

Anyway, I hope Ratty decides to appeal his fate. Update: He did not have to. DPR said they made a mistake, he is only gone 6 days.

Here is something  a lurker on the forum sent me …

attack-pack (2)

It is cute …
  • Snow White is, of course the new female member of the pack. She does play the role of shepherd now and again …
  • Dopey would probably map to someone who posts nonsense technical comparisons and information :-)
  • Grumpy has been permanently banned, as all he ever did was post threads that crapped on the forum …
  • Doc is an intellectual, and if there ever was one on the attack pack, he is long gone …
  • Happy … I got nothin’ …
  • Bashful could be someone who is demure right up until the knife goes in … any ideas?
  • Sneezy could be someone who is invisible for long periods and then returns to spray the forum violently …
  • Sleepy is slow and heavy lidded … well that could be anyone in the pack or even a whack job who likes to stalk me from his crib …
Thanks to the unnamed lurker who sent that … it is a fun exercise :-)

Update 2: Ted (tdkd13) was also banned, and that makes zero sense to me.

Update 3: Royslaw started a 4th toxic thread yesterday to continue a long and very boring argument on concert shooting. But it was dripping in arrogance as a direct attack on stephen 06. He’s gone today.

And down in the comments section, I single out one member for special treatment … and here is why:
(name removed to avoid the threat of fictitious legal action :-) So, for everyone else - What to do ? When these folk return, if it is just the same old nonsense,
complain. 
In fact, DPR says to do just that. That's right ! Push the button and state your case. Is it a shame to do so ? DPR rules state - " ... Have a complaint about a particular poster? 
Contact us immediately, don't antagonize the situation by replying ... "Simply,
no matter who it is, follow this advice."
The arrogance implied in that message is staggering. DPReview moderators have two jobs, and they hate the moderating one. So they often go with sheer volume (popularity contest) … and what is he calling for? Higher volumes … complain, complain, complain … no doubt the true sheep in the herd will ignore the shame they accrue and follow suit …

30 comments:

r said...

Petty bans don't count.

Kim Letkeman said...

The last two were entirely petty from what I can tell ... It's all a little middle school ...

But at least the traffic can settle back down to and endless stream of stultifying post processing hacks and assortments of familiar images from the land of the contrasty sun ...

That should satisfy what is apparently a voracious appetite for quotidian content ... and give the contention-adverse somewhere to trade attaboys ...

Ratty Mouse said...

Well, at least your ban was temporary. Mine was permanent. DPR notified me that I would never be allowed to post there again. Amazing.

Kim Letkeman said...

Ratty ... WTF? You and I may not always agree, but I don't consider you one of the bad guys ... sheesh. I would guess that your bad luck was to be the 3rd man in with a controversial thread ... I think Richard survived and his was second. I presume Yanko survived, his was first. Although I disliked all three threads, none of them struck me as permanent ban fodder ... Anyway, very sorry to hear that ... One thing I do know is that, if you are willing to try to adopt a different style (as I did - despite so many claims to the contrary from the baby button pushers), you might be able to ask the mods for a second chance. That's how I came back from permanent ban number 2. I really think that they want to stay open and would prefer to avoid censoring the membership too harshly, but they will need an olive branch they can believe. Just a thought ...

RattyMouse said...

Maybe I could petition for a reprieve. However, I think I've passed the point of no return. DPR is such a toxic environment that it is probably only a matter of time until I get tossed again due to complaints against me. I dont think it matters how much I change. Maybe if I became a Lloydy sycophant I'd be OK. I'll pass on that.

I'll just spend my time taking more pictures.

Adrian said...

Wow! Both of you banned? Can't believe you got a permanent ban Ratty, I think you should do what Kim suggests and leave it a couple of weeks and get in touch with the mods. It would be a huge shame if you didn't come back!

I think DPR really have some odd ideas about moderating. It's a shame as it could be hugely improved by just having active moderators that are a bit more visible stepping in to lock threads and tone down arguments from time to time. I don't think there would be anywhere near as many bans and less damage to their reputation.

Was anyone else banned? I guess it's going to be a very quiet few weeks!

Adrian said...

Forgot to mention, Adrian = TDR1.

John said...

Well Kim and Ratty I am sorry to hear you have both been banned. I hope you get around it Ratty and are able to come back as yourself. If you don't and have to morph may I suggest a wolf gravatar? Kim I look forward to your return

Kim Letkeman said...

Ratty: I agree that DPR gets toxic way too often. Instead of discussing photography, we just had a week where the only really active threads were "crap on the forum membership" threads. The number of people who strolled in for just a moment to defecate on the forum (and DPR) was pretty surprising. Some have stuck around to crow while Bill, you and I are away ... but watch what they do in a few weeks when their bull shit gets challenged :-)

I also noted that ukwoody (which perhaps describes the composition of a certain cerebral organ?)is again quoting the 14 ban balogna that Jada started (out of spite of course) ... woodman -- the number is 9 now. Maybe 8.

Anyway, do consider coming back after a rest. But take it a bit less seriously, as there is no quid pro quo from the forum itself.

Adrian: Thanks, I was about to check who else got nailed when I saw Paul's comment about Bill. I would love to have seen the reason on his notice :-)

John, I appreciate the support, as always. Ratty could try a Phoenix for his next avatar ... I no longer qualify since I have risen twice :-)

tdkd13 said...

Aparently I was banned as well. Not sure why as I never updated my email address at DPReview so I never saw an email stating it. However if I try and respond to a post I get some message about innapropriate behavior or some such. Can't really figure out what post may have sparked anything as I have only posted about 6 times this week andnone seemed remotely controversial to me.
Oh well.
Ted (tdkd13)

Clive said...

Ratty,

I know we have "had words" in the past but considered that fleeting. I would not have had you banned under these circumstances. It seems that name-calling, sexual innuendo and vulgar comments to a fellow member are all acceptable but to question what "the management" are doing is not. Really not acceptable from DPR. I have written to them so maybe I'll be joining you all! Meanwhile morph into something else and come back to the forum.

Clive

About Me said...

The "new" ban queen stalking you is debbie renae. She has been banned continually from the day she started at DPR, in fact her second (of 5) threads that she started was thanking Phil for allowing her back! She has sense learned that, in her words, "banning is no big deal." Now that you have some time on your hands, her posting history is pretty funny.

She is seeks the attention and approval of conrad birdie (who has recently shunned her after realizing what a wack job she is.) Now one that knows her wants anything to do with her, she may eventually just fade away. Oh, kim, her low post count is because most of what she posts gets deleted - just as it did this week.

Conrad is of course a blow hard "troll hunter", he and few other "troll hunters" keep a data base of "suspected" trolls and other people that disagree with them, then launch complaint attacks on them. What fun lives they must have!

RattyMouse said...

Here's an update folks. Got an email from DPR that notified me that I have received a second ban. This time the ban was temporary. How can that matter since I had a permanent ban? It's like getting 20 years in jail, AFTER you had the death penalty. Well, in the notes section, they said that my permanent ban was in fact, a temp one. Someone must have screwed up.

So I'm in jail for 6 days.

punditpawn said...

Oh my. Hope you guys all come back after your vacations. 21 days? Ratty totally gone? Jesus. Bunch of kids.

Who designs a forum of diverse people and personalities and expects there will never be conflict or that clicks wouldn't form and gang up on certain members when the mass-complain-button gets abused?

Sucks. I like all you guys and am not fond of these internet bans for stupid stuff. Now there's just a bunch of HS-10 fanboys left prowling the FTF forum.

william said...

Hi Kim - sorry you are banned; I will probably just skip the Fujifilm forum till you are back. I have no real interest in Fuji (love my S100fs but its just a toy and no plans to get any other Fuji).

Ratty I only read occasionally but I hate to see permanent bans.

As for active moderation - Dpreview is a business, owned by Amazon; costs too much to actively moderate and gains the business nothing.

Best regards Bill Wilson

About Me said...

Ratty "teed off on the moderators pretty harshly"

That was his undoing. The moderators will tolerate stalkers, troll hunters, gang complaint button pushers and all-round whiners - BUT, they can not and will not stand for any criticism of themselves.

You once mentioned the young ages of the mods, I believe you are right. They are too immature to to handle the control they have to ban, they themselves are controlled by their young emotions and childish reactions.

They lack a mature ability to moderate with detached professionalism.

tdkd13 said...

Seems I too was banned for some unknown reason. I was just going to make a reply to a seriously technically challenged individual who just posted that airlines are no longer allowing Lithium Ion batteries on flights so they are planning on using one of the 3 S602Z Pro's they own for a while longer.
Has anyone else EVER had an airline ask about what battery technology is being used in their cameras? I fly weekly and have NEVER been asked, not once.
Ted (tdkd13)

ukdelboy said...

Sorry to see you guys got clobbered again.

Ratty: Good to see you haven't been permanently banned.

Best regards,
Del

billx08 said...

> Kim Letkeman said...
>
> Adrian: Thanks, I was about to check who else got nailed when I saw Paul's comment about Bill. I would love to have seen the reason on his notice :-)

Since my posts were quite low for the last week or so it might have been for a reply that criticized one of Amazon's affiliates that sent me a cheap, defective Tiffen filter when I ordered the advertized B+W filter (I didn't mention the company name) and for criticizing Amazon re. the Kindle (trying to monopolize media content). The reason given was "airing dirty laundry". DPR should always provide some context (like quotes, if the 'offending' post was deleted) so the 'banned' know what they were 'guilty' of doing. So far DPR hasn't provided a requested response to my feedback concerning questions I had about the ban. I'm not expecting a reply even though they claim that they will, when asked for a response. DPR prefers to provide zero information, probably either following company legal advise to protect their asses, or (speaking of asses) just doing what Phil and the other smug, arrogant DPR leaders would do. I assume that once again one or more of the 'attack pack' whiners will send a link for this page to DPR.

Banning rattymouse was bad enough but banning tdkd13 was just insane. As far as I'm concerned this adds to the proof that DPR's moderators are either extremely incompetent, too lazy to provide effective policing of the forums (to the great detriment of the forums) or they succumb to vengeance against those that criticize them in any way. They become highly offended, resorting to catty, sarcastic comments when their reviews are criticized (circling their wagons like Gary and his fawning posse). In a couple of recent replies I mentioned that DPR's reviews of high end DSLRs no longer include all of the technical data that they used to provide. I wonder if this also pissed them off, enough to look for any excuse to levy a ban. They may also have been PO'd due to my mentioning Thom Hogan in a recent, previous feedback.

You guessed correctly, just 7 days for my 'vacation', and I should add for the idiot rumormongers, my 27th, so I'm well ahead of you, Kim. (No, just the second, but those idiots aren't likely to read this far.) BTW, I met Jason Odell yesterday and he's a _really_ nice guy, and another that doesn't frequent DPR's forums like he used to. Wonder why? Here's a link to some photos taken by his crew of Ninjas and Ninjettes (remember when Jada was an honorary Ninjette? Now she wants to leave us wondering if she's as hung as her hubby.) My photos are identified as being "Uploaded by Bill on Oct 31, 2010"

http://www.meetup.com/jason-odell-photo/photos/all_photos/?photoAlbumId=1130386

r said...

Ted,

No, never have been asked re battery technology. I take it that's just another deluded comment from the person who owns 3 of the same cams but can't operate any of them and found an open box S100FS and has started flying to Tahoe/Reno.

The delusion is up there with the inflatable Halloween "kitty" that was a dog. And then there was the -5F. You know the drill.

After the fire and fatality of a cargo plane carrying Lithium Ion batteries there may be a reaction to curb these on flights. Apparently the warnings fell on deaf ears for years.

But this particular user is the one who removes his batteries after each outing, so who knows what battery buttons of his got pushed and thus what is fact and what is fiction. Some airlines may begin restrictions, but that seems difficult to enforce given the widespread use of these batteries.

Kim Letkeman said...

Ok, time for me to weigh in again.

First, thanks everyone for contributing to the information available here ... obviously this post is very well read since even the horse's asses are quoting from it now ...

A horse's ass can apparently be at the same time on his or her high horse. Incredible ... really.

Ted: WTF? Your ban makes no sense.

Ratty: Glad to see you got your reprieve.

Clive ... thanks for weighing in. You still out there? :-)

punditpawn: The forum is getting pretty dull, although watching Dave crow might be worth it. What an arrogant, self righteous buffoon he can be ...

Bill W: Thanks for the support, as always.

About Me: I have come to understand that the mods hate this part of their job and get it over as quickly and painlessly as possible, which sometimes means mass banning as now. The amusing thing is that the cure is worse than the disease and the germs all sit around talking about how great the cesspool is with only them in it :-)

Del: Thanks for the support.

Billx08: Yeah ... I think you were just a button victim again. The "dude" is now crowing that maybe they should start using the button more often. What a joke ... some of them hammer it all the time.

Dotbalm: I thought lithium ion was already on some restriction. The one in the laptop and that is all. But perhaps they also include the ones in cameras soon. That would be very painful ... I'll bet the manufacturers will be looking for alternate technologies soon ...

Kim Letkeman said...

By the way ... anyone note that royslaw has gone bye bye? That toxic thread he tried to get going as an attack on stephen 06 appears to have failed :-) ... nudge nudge, wink wink.

r said...

Kim, good point, you fly much more than I do judging by your trips and I wasn't even thinking about laptops. FWIW, whenever I bring a laptop (carry-on), which is every time since that's where I back up my images, they make me power it on. That, and they run it through the machine. A scalding cup of coffee and 2nd degree wrist burns later and I'm off to the terminal. : )

ukdelboy said...

The "Hangcuffed and gagged" thread has just been locked. I guess the baby button pushers have been doing their usual dirty deed again.

Is there nothing sacred;)

Kim Letkeman said...

Dotbalm, I think Ted should weigh in on air travel and batteries as he seems to be in the air all the time.

Del, I'm surprised about the handcuffed and gagged thread getting locked, but it might have been caused by the sudden suggestion of "let's max this one out" and the attendant total waste of server space.

That thread was yet another raunchy attack pack insult-fest ... even Yanko could not resist teeing off on Buckshot, so the whole thing turned into crap. And Bill and I were not around ... so hopefully that will give the mods a bit of insight into the *real* problems in the FTF ...

billx08 said...

Kim Letkeman wrote:

> And Bill and I were not around ... so hopefully that will give the mods a bit of insight into the *real* problems in the FTF ...

I'm not sure about their insight, but earlier this morning I brightened their day with a gripe about that thread, including a few representative quotes :

[Yanko Kitanov]
> I don't say lacking Kim is good or bad, I just say that without him and that Bill guy of course, it is so easy to keep the discussion civilized, well besides my HAHA reply

[Yanko Kitanov]
> And cut the talk about the bile OK? There was not even one word of bile against Kim, or anybody here.

[ukmick]
> They all sound so nice! and it turns out that they are.....
Now let me turn to another favourite! 'LET me be the KEy MAN'

DPR still has not replied to my requests for feedback even though they imply that they will ("if you requested a response we'll get back to you as soon as possible.") So maybe I pushed someone's button hard enough for them to take some action. I was polite but not fawning like some in the attack pack do when they think the mods may be lurking, so even though I probably annoyed them a bit with a few choice words describing their actions ("kangaroo court", but at least they have so far shown themselves to be more or less fair since I haven't yet received notice of a ban extension. They may be quicker to pull the trigger in the future though.

Kim Letkeman said...

Well Bill, I think the worm has turned ... with several members of the attack pack openly calling for complaints as often as "necessary" -- and we know that necessary is a euphemism for "whenever you get upset" -- we should be seeing a lot of bans in the future. The mods are busy and will go with the majority as they always have.

RattyMouse said...

All these urgings to hit the complaint button may backfire on our fragile friends. My first (and only until this recent one) banning was due to me hitting the complaint button. One particular poster was going from trashy into the obscene. I hit the complaint button on him a few times and BINGO, I was banned.

I guess I was complaining about myself so got banned.

Kim Letkeman said...

Ratty, I can't quite remember where I read it, but there definitely is great risk in repeat offenses with the button. I too feel that at least one of my bans was from using the button too much ... that was an experimental phase where I wanted to give as good as I got. Didn't work.

What I learned from that was that there are probably quite a few souls who feel that they should clean up the FTF by getting rid of people they don't like. It kind of warms the cockles of my heart to know that there are so many colossal pricks out there ... how about you? :-)

About Me said...

Pushing the complaint button too often is, in of itself, supposed to be a ban-able offense. But, there are serial c-button pushers that get others to do the same, that are still here. Bird-brain birdie, dumb-ass debbie and Joseph Whats-his-name come to mind. Bird-brain and Whats-his-name do contribute once in a while, as they build their troll data base and gang up on people they disagree with - but dumb-ass is a very sad case, all she does is tag after birdie and try to "spot" trolls. What she doesn't realize is that she herself is a troll and has contributed absolutely nothing to DPR in her FIVE years!!

She is her own definition of a troll! She has NEVER posted a photo, NEVER voted in a challenge, has no web site and no email!